BTW I don't dance well but this has been enlightening. You all need to go to some serious debates, dig deep and I still encourage you all to read your bible and get into a great devotional, it is called "my Utmost for His Highest." pure classic and you can get it on the web. Pray before you read because it will torment you. Again the challenge, read it for 1 month, along with a proverb and 5 Psalms a day and see if it doesn't make you mad, sad, glad and change you Heck I might hang around just to see the responses. That is if you have the WHootzpa or read the 4 gospels for 3 months and see if you don't get a clearer vision of Jesus the Christ. You will be more passionate than I am when you are thru.
Okay, fine. I asked... Ormly never responded and I didn't ask Pastor G. ------------------------------------------------------------------ I asked... He(?) answered me with this, which was no answer at all. I didn't ask Pastor G because I didn't need to since he is PASTOR G. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- I asked... No reply from Ormly, didn't need to ask Pastor G. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- I asked.... No response. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Your turn.
R2K will you give me a day to read your links? I have not read them but know of HB and the names of some others. It is late and would like to sign off for the night, thanks respectfully submitted eW Ps I will answer
Given you can speculate, how would you judge that of anyone on a forum as this? I could supply you with any number that you would regardless and ultimately, take issue. Being a Christian you should know fruit can't be estimated in such a way. Given your way of measuring such things I could rightly ask what kind of fruit you are producing; what kind of fruit is hanging from the tree you have planted. No, Pastor, your question is a poor one. I have anonymity, you don't. You have only this forum to gage me. Everyone has your website and your assembly to gage you, plus this forum. Being informed is everyone's responsibility and we all are accountable. I read your words, your premature assessment of me; I observed and resourced your website and, being quite familiar with the foundation and building blocks used by the CGM, I don't believe I have mis-judged or mis-applied any feelings in the matters discussed here, either yours, nor mine. There is none who, in that day, will be able to point to anyone, to blame, as the reason they didn't come to know the Lord Jesus as He desires to be known, i.e., intimately. No one will be allowed to give Ormly as an excuse for refusing God's saving Grace; to say as the reason, "It was Ormly's hard words of warning I didn't understand that turned me off". No one will be excused because they didn't know. They can know, and should know what is being offered them to embrace as, "The Way". Shepherds have the responsibilty to lead the "Way" as Paul knew it to be, not as RW or anyone else of this modern age with a secular agenda, desires it now to be known and to be embraced. Responsiblity falls on both the speaker and the listener. "To whom much is given, much is required". We all have been given much. Here is the warning to us all: * "For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness"; .....28 "......they did not like to retain God in their knowledge" ....."And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold. .....and God will give them over to the "snare". "......... when the Son of Man comes, will He really find faith on the earth?" *Romans 1:18; Matt.24.12;(KJV) Luke 18:8 (NKJV) I sincerely hope and because of this awkward exchange, many will come to visit your church, to hear what you speak and gauge your words and assembly with the hunger they have for Christ Jesus; those who long to be in relationship with Him; using their knowledge of the Bible that places Christ first over the "felt needs" of "hurting people". I hope they hear music that will bring a sense of worship into the sanctuary unto God and not the "Rolling Stones" entertainment for kids at the expense of sincere worship from those who long to offer their love to the Father. Who, if they can't, have no other corporate outlet. But then maybe those kind of folk have all died off and need not anylonger, be considered? I hope they see reverence for God in the sanctuary that promotes the atomsphere for worship to the unlearned; that they not see coffee cups and water bottles nor any other "Cotton Candy" incentives; that they witness people dressed for His presence and not appear as going to the beach or the ball game [with their caps on turned around backwards] or those who look as just getting off the back end of the plow, teaching Sunday school. Most of all, I hope they hear a message from the pulpit they won't forget 0-5 minutes after getting up out of their seats. Do you think that's what they will see and hear, Pastor? You are the leader and if you conducted such an assembly I would even attend. I would willingly assist you in fighting a [the] good fight of faith...and we would win. God, indeed can do the impossible, however, He must be allowed to have freedom to do so. He must not be inhibited nor compromised in any way that smacks of "man pleasing worship" or man's reasoning in the mix. I could write more on this but this should suffice at least for the moment. You may have a question that will lead to more. I will wait and see. I really don't mean any of this as a personal attack, Pastor, though I full well know it can't be avoided when speaking objectively. It is always difficult to say something right, without getting it wrong. For that, I ask your forgiveness. Thank you. Orm
Ormly, read below my reply. I'm not good with the whole quote thing so you will need to read between the lines.
That spoke volumes Ormly, I finally understand what it is you're saying now. Thank you for making it clear. It makes me think of a song called, "I'll Stick With the Old Stuff." Click the link and you can hear a sample of it (#11). http://www.therochesterfamily.com/music.htm
PastorG, it's almost impossible to tell what you are saying and where you are quoting Ormly in the above post. Maybe you could just edit that post and bold all of your remarks? That would make it more clear, without having to mess with the quote thing.
Psalms 82:1-8 (KJV) 82: God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods [Rulers]. He asks: "How long will ye judge unjustly, and accept the persons of the wicked? [show partiality to the wicked] " Selah. He commands: "Defend the poor and fatherless: do justice to the afflicted and needy. Deliver the poor and needy: rid them out of the hand of the wicked". The Lord laments: "They know not, neither will they understand; they walk on in darkness: all the foundations of the earth are out of course. I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High. But ye shall die like men, and fall like one of the princes. Arise, O God, judge the earth: for thou shalt inherit all nations.
What about??? What about this music??? UNDEROATH It's christian It's probably not good though because younger generations can relate to this music and not pipe organs and a choir, not saying theres anything wrong with that, just how many kids do you hear with that in their cd player?
Totally offended Quote (by PastorG): People want to change... they want what Jesus has to offer (eternal life and a changed life) Quote (by Ormly): Whoa Partner! How is it that “accepting Jesus Christ as my Savior” or “accepting Jesus Christ into my life”, going to change anyone? This is how you present it, isn’t it? I’ll just bet you have people in your assembly who have worn out their re-dedicaters. Ok, dude, now you've offended me. I do not attend Pastor G's church, never have, never will (no offense, PastorG). A year ago I didn't attend church at all. Those on this board who know me well, know why. They n-e-v-e-r judged me either. They prayed for me, over me, and about me. Those that knew they could, told me they were praying for me. In the fall, my best friend wanted to visit the first church she could remember. She was nervous and I went along for moral support. The next Sunday, she wanted to go to a local church that she goes to most of the time. Again, I went for moral support...only. From that Sunday to this, I have missed church for things out of town, that's all. She's not always there, and that's ok. I started going to that church for her, kept going to that church to spend time with her, and stay with that church because it is where I was lead back to Jesus. Shortly after beginning to go, and through learning about Him at that church, my daughter accepted Jesus Christ as her Savior. I tried a few times but it was never a truthful thing. December 10th, it was truthful. From that day until today, my life has changed. No, there wasn't any big opening of the skies and light pouring down. No, I don't hear God speaking to me every night when I say prayers. No, God doesn't shout into my ear when I'm frustrated and beg for answers. Yes, I feel differently inside. Yes, I have learned that it isn't my timing, it's His, frustrating as that still is. Yes, I'm am trying to figure out what it is He intends for me so I can do that. I still face crap in my life, I'm still human, I still make mistakes, bad choices can still plague me. One thing is for sure, tho... I am not the same person I was December 9th. I have accepted Christ as my Savior and want to walk a path that is His will. As bad as things are in my life right now, I know it's where I am supposed to be, I'm learning from it, I'm understanding, and I'm ready to trudge on and see what else he has in store for me. How dare you insinuate to me, and every other reader on this board, that accepting Christ won't change me. If you aren't a devout person, don't claim to be. What you espoused to Pastor G above is not the writing of a person who believes in Christ. Frogger
I know, I know, I know. <slapping wrist> and me on the Troll Patroll to boot. Been slackin on the job lately! K, lin, I'm out. No more feeding these trolls!! Frogger
Very good, Frogger. A very good reprimand to someone who apparently isn't getting his point across very well. If I didn't know you better I would be inclined to immediately ask for your forgiveness, However, since you have seen fit to make it known that Jesus Christ is your savior, I wonder if you know Him as Lord? Lets see. You say, "I am not the same person I was December 9th.", and yet I wonder if your friends can see a difference that would cause them to ask: Hey Frogger! What 's with you and this Jesus thing? You also say this that I find interesting, "I have accepted Christ as my Savior and want to walk a path that is His will", and having read of your many posts on this forum I find no evidence of your pursuit of His will for your life. Now don't mis-understand me This is NOT an attack on you dear one, but and attack on our "churchiolgy" that sez all you need to do is accept Jesus in yer heart and He will take away your sins and sorrow and pain and struggles. He will fix your marriage, bless you with abundance, fix your kids, the dog won't bark any more at nite. He'll heal you, teach you, make you sweet, rich, beautiful, and you will be filled with happiness and peace and joy and love and you'll be a new person, live for Jesus and get people saved. All of this and without even reading your Bible. Isn't that essentially what you bought into? No need to blush I did, as did most others. Some folk manage to come with a little something to their credit, but not many. I mean, it was just going to happen. But it never did and it never does. The Bible says, that God is our Sheild and Buckler in times of trouble. Sad to say but most today in our self-serving churches have Him as servant and butler, with a big tray of goodies in His hand. Oh, I know I have exaggerated a bit, but my point is, it is inferred that Jesus will miraclously/magically perform something for/in us that will make us difference; we will somehow be automatically transformed into His likeness and image. However, It doesn't work that way Frog and it didn't that way for you either. Hebrews 12:2 (KJV) Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God. 01-2006 The Lord Jesus Christ is the Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end; the first and the last. We were in Him at the first and will be in Him at the last. Between the first and the last, we are in the world to become [a son]. The first and the last, He is responsible for. The in-between is our responsibility. It is given to us to become as He was in His flesh. Without a vision of the last, we will not become that which is purposed by the Father. The vision of the last is implanted in us from the first. A revelation of the first, the Christ of Glory, brings the vision of the last that will sustain the in-between... which is now. The vision is the understanding of His Grace; the overflowing of His Nature. If that seems a play on words let me add this having to with the sustaining vision: “Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.” (John 3:3) The new birth gives the new enablement of vision whereby I can begin to discern God’s Grace; His reign in my life. His rule was there all the time and true to His nature. Now that I have received His nature, I can see His reign because I can “see” His Grace. Now the question I have is this: Do you have a vision of the Father? Did you you have a revelation of Jesus Christ to receive Him or was it that someone simply had you repeat after him a few words...... and you will be saved? Think about it. Jeremiah 29:13 And you shall seek me, and find me, when you search for me with all your heart. I pray this will be a help and not hurt unto a dispairing.
