Makes me ashamed to be from Johnston County

I dunno. I think Melynda might still have her beat, AND Melynda's was all original content not c/p.

Hi Melynda!! Not much time for novels nowadays, eh?

 

More Bad news.............

Just read in the N&O they are now searching for more books to "ban" even though nobody has raised additional complaints about other books. Way to go JC. Just when people were starting to think we weren't so backasswards here. They claim they are merely comparing their current inventory to a list of nationally banned books (Shouldn't they have done that when the books came in the first place). But I'm sure some nut ball will try to get the "Wizard of Oz" or Voltaire’s "Candide" removed as well.

Viva el JC Gestapo! :roll:

 

DB,

I do not think that YOU are burying your head. I know of many parents who do.

What "community standard" are you talking about? Do you really think that one pocket of this county can represent what another pocket thinks? I would submit that there are certain pockets that are far to the right, as well as some who are far to the left. And, at any point, distance from one extreme is a movement along the spectrum. If my POV were extremely one side or the other, even the center position wouldn't adequately represent my interests.

It is folly to presume that Mr. Fred and I would share the same outlook on many things, as I feel that his interests probably correspond to "Gimme that old time religion" and mine are Leftist liberal drivel from his perspective.

And, yet again, I feel that I must remind us of Jefferson's words that rule by the majority is a tyranny of the minority.

I do believe that we can and should reach a consensus.

I don't believe that it will occur if my interests are negated because I'm so not a part of the Good Old Boy, the Old Johnston County home of the Klan crowd. Lest you find this view as unbelievable, rest assured that within recent memory, there was a huge billboard near the intersection of 95 and 70, "welcoming" people to Smithfield, Home of the Ku Klux Klan, fighting communism and integration.

From my position, I feel that the overreaction of the board reflected an overreaction by, as far as we know, one set of parents. Where was the public discussion? How do those who seek to represent us know how we feel on the issues, IF THEY DON'T ASK?

 

Ms Puff,

There is an old saying that when you're yelling so loudly that I can't understand your message, then no communication can exist.

I respect your position and your passion. Adding comments as you have above, seem to make it easier to dismiss your message. I am as concerned with the political and academic events we face here as anyone I know.

I am not trying to flame you, nor am I insulting you. It seems to me that the less adversarial your comments are, the greater the likelihood that they will not be dismissed outright.

H6

 

Well said. You make a good point. I will keep that in mind.

Thank you.

 

Your advice is taken.

Grace

 

I believe you were asking about pornography and political books in our original discussion and that is why I used those as rulings. In those same rulings they state "religion", which would mean anti christian as well. In my long Post the Supreme Court ruled on the anti American books if you look at the ruling on the "Hero Sandwich".

Grace

 

In the case you quoted the Court ruled that because one has certain views either Conservative or Liberal does not mean that all in the school district believe the same way nor should the children only see views from one side. The court decided that children should be able to expand their minds by reading all views. Whether the school district leans one way or another every child should learn both sides.

Grace

 

I got the message...thought some might just want to read it on here and others from the links. I will cut it back in the future.

Grace

 

nope. this conversation has been about borderline stuff. as i have stated multiple times (i think this proves that people don't read whole posts if they're too long) i use hustler as an example of inappropriate material that we all can agree on, that's all. i never brought up religious or anti american books, other than to reference the fact that the links you posted were about those types of books, rather than the type of book we were talking about in this thread, which are borderline adult sexual content books.

you should read your own links, grace. much of the information in them doesn't jive with your line of reasoning, and only goes to serve mine. from that same link (#16 i quoted above)

"With this factual premise as its background, the court rejected respondents' contention that their First Amendment rights had been infringed by the Board's actions. Noting that statutes, history, and precedent had vested local school boards with a broad discretion to formulate educational policy, 13 the court concluded that it should not intervene in "'the daily operations of school systems'" unless "'basic constitutional values'" were "'sharply [implicated],'" 14 and determined that the conditions for such intervention did not exist in the present case. Acknowledging that the "removal [of the books] . . . clearly was content-based," the court nevertheless found no constitutional violation of the requisite magnitude:

The board has restricted access only to certain books which the board believed to be, in essence, vulgar. While removal of such books from a school library may . . . reflect a misguided educational philosophy, it does not constitute a sharp and direct infringement of any first amendment right." Id., at 397. "


hello? that says that the school board restricted books it considered "vulgar", ie adult sexual content, and was perfectly within the rights granted by the first amendment to do so.

 

I think you and DB are talking about two different things here. You are saying the school board cannot remove books because of their political ideas. I agree with you. DB is saying the school can remove books because of sexual content, even if they do not qualify as pornography. I agree with him.

Please correct me if I am mischaracterizing your statements.

 

dead on.

 

I was addressing your Post above on "political ideas vs. adult sexual content.

Grace

 

you don't read.

you are the one that started posting links to cases. of those links, the ones i read were not about sexual content, which is what we were talking about, but political ideas. political ideas are not, nor have they at any time been what we were talking about


ok, maybe i could have worded that differently, but i meant please address the content of my post in the context of talking about sexual content instead of in the context of political ideas.

 

Okay, I see what happened and guess I misinterpreted what DB was asking. I still do not believe the school board can remove books because of sexual content, even if they do not qualify as pornography. I will look at this later and make a shorter Post.

Sorry, DB, got lost in the research and missed that one point you were asking about. Will get back to you later today because I want to make sure I am quoting the Exact case that went before the Supreme Court and the ruling.

Thanks to both of you for this wonderful discussion and making this old brain work hard.

Grace

 

grace

read the parts i quoted above that are about sexual content. they say that the school board has every right and that the 1st amendment rights were not violated

 

Yes, I read it as addressing both and that is what I was trying to do. I will put aside the political rulings and concentrate on sexual content only.

Grace

 

cool. hard to keep everybody on the same page for three days, isn't it?

 

Very much so, but I am enjoying this and learning alot. Discussing this with you and others is fun. I'm off to research and will Post on this one later today.

Grace

 

H6,
We are on the same page this time around! You have truly hit the nail on the head. Thank you!

DB- I think once your child is in older school years you will see what H6 & I have been saying.
ex:
3 Years ago @ WJHS the school resource officer had to turn in what was found on a bus to the Principal. As embarrassing as it was for him when he droped it on the desk & it took off in motion. I hope u can gather what this instument might be. There has been pornogrpahy at every level of school found on school grounds in childrens possession.

There are middle schoolers & High schoolers getting caught doing the deed on school grounds. Also getting caught is boys in a position receiving. These things are going to continue to happen. They are kids they will find the resources to do what they want to do.

Banning books is not going to change things. There are so many other sources & outlets for these kids. They are going to hear it, see it some how some way.

Bottom line is again Mr. Fred did not have the right to do what he did. What H6 posted in regards to the rule is completely accurate. The parents know well in advance what they will be reading & it is a choice. They can not force it on you.

Hinky posted what is correct about Mr. Fred banning books now.
This is part of the good ole boy crap that needs to be put to an end. His child/ children are no longer in this school system. I have been in this county long enough to see that this is just one more step of a man thinking he rules our children. He took my rights away from me & my children when he did this. He took the rights of every other student & parent in this county to benefit him & him alone.

If you have not worked or volunteered time in JOCO schools then you would not really know all the underhanded things that go on & continue to go on. Take time to get in the schools & listen & you will learn.