Pope On A Rope, that’s where a lot of the people that live in the Sand World would like to put The Pope right now. A Few Clippings from the Web World: "Muslim religious leaders have accused Pope Benedict XVI of quoting anti-Islamic remarks during a speech at a German university this week." "Questioning the concept of holy war, he quoted a 14th-Century Christian emperor who said Muhammad had brought the world only "evil and inhuman" things." "The emperors words were, he said: "Show me just what Muhammad brought that was new and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." Benedict said "I quote" twice to stress the words were not his and added that violence was "incompatible with the nature of God and the nature of the soul". "The Pope is due to visit Turkey in November and the Turkish response was swift and strong, asking for an apology for the "hostile" words." END OF THE Web World, (and into mine): Benedict is trying to dodge the stupid-barrage by quoting others. I’m liking him all of a sudden, unless/until he starts rolling-over; now is when he needs to speak up even more. Of coarse, better cancel that trip to Turkey or either leave the Pope-mobile home and take an Abrams M1A2 Tank because if he met his Maker there it might start a Holy War with the JIHAD -verses- The CRUSADERS. (ps: "Pope On A Rope" was an old Sat Nite Live Skit)
I spent nearly a half an hour trying to come up with a response to SpunkyPunky's drivvel. Unfortunately this level of ignorance is just way too far beyond anything that I could come up with.
Spunky, I believe you have missed the point as to why the Muslim community is upset. He's the Pope. The leader for the Catholic church. Yes he quoted something that wasn't his words but nonetheless. And when you say Ragheads I assume you are speaking of the Muslims or "so called" Muslims that are better known as al-Qaeda (sp?) They are not "normal" Muslims. There are good Muslims and bad Muslims. The good one's are offended by the Pope's oversite, and grouping them all together... the good and the bad. And the Pope has apologized 2 times that I know of. :? Am I wrong people?
I think you are absolutely right in suggesting that we should not lump all Muslims together, just as any such generalities are inaccurate. After 9/11 some of us say, "Muslims fly airplanes into buildings." But after the Murra Federal Building was attacked, I don't recall hearing anyone say, "White guys blow up buildings." We don't generalize about people who are like us, only about those we consider "other." As to the Pope's "apology" I think he said he was sorry they were upset, not that he was sorry he said it. True, he was quoting a 14th century emperor, and the quote from his lecture may have been taken out of context, I have not read a transcript (if one even exists). But if that was cited in his lecture as an example of erroneous thought, there shold be a quote to show that, and it should take care of the problem. My impression is that he was saying that using violence to spread the faith is not God's will. I guess he forgot about the Crusades. And the Spanish Inquisition. I like to think that Christians have moved beyond that mindset, but there are still those who use the Bible to justify hate and violence, just as there are those who quote the Koran to justify hate and violence. I hope and believe there are many more people who try to obey the instructions in both the Bible and the Koran to love and care for one another.
"Islam rejects characterizing God in any human form or depicting Him as favoring certain individuals or nations on the basis of wealth, power or race. He created the human beings as equals. They may distinguish themselves and get His favor through virtue and piety only. The concept that God rested in the seventh day of creation, that God wrestled with one of His soldiers, that God is an envious plotter against mankind, or that God is incarnate in any human being are considered blasphemy from the Islamic point of view. The unique usage of Allah as a personal name of God is a reflection of Islam's emphasis on the purity of the belief in God which is the essence of the message of all God's messengers. Because of this, Islam considers associating any deity or personality with God as a deadly sin which God will never forgive, despite the fact He may forgive all other sins." The high-lighted statement definately disagrees with how christians view creation. As such based on the fact that christians look at "God" in a different light then they should be punished upon their death and never forgiven based on the last line of the above quote. The above quote came from http://www.islam101.com which offers an introduction into the Islamic religion. Also on that particular website it is stated that Allah (God's personal name) never begot a son, while in the chirstian belief Jesus Christ was the begotton son of God and sent here to pay for our sins. I'm not a master theologist, and don't care to be but there are differences between the christian and islamic religions that would force either side to condemn the other for their beliefs. Craig
The fact that there are basic, fundamental differences between Christianity and Islam doesn't mean we need to condemn each other; I think it's God who does the condemning under each belief system. We should be able to live peaceably on the same earth, even though some of us believe others of us are going to hell when we die. (I hope that's not generalizing too much -- I personally cannot say anyone is going to hell, because I do not know anyone else's heart.)
In fact there is a transcript, or two. Slate has a copy obtained from the Vatican's web site. Why not just go there to read it? Because the copy on Slate has some interesting annotations, including a link to a very funny Monty Python video. (Is that redundant?) http://youtube.com/watch?v=JDlwBxT8uyk Just in case you want to go straight to Monty Python and skip the transcript. Here's a link to the annotated transcript: http://www.slate.com/id/2149875/entry/0/
According to the Muslim belief anyone who believes other than they do religously is already condemned. I thought I had made that clear in my previous post. And that comes direct from the web site listed. It's not whether or not we or they need to comdemn one another, the Islamic religion itself already does that for us. Craig
Anyone who criticizes Islam had better watch out for his life. Christianity is attacked every day with impugnity. That is the difference between civilization and barbarism.
But don't most Christian denominations believe that anyone who doesn't believe salvation is through Jesus Christ is already condemned? Remember...it wasn't Christians that flew the planes into the Twin Towers..of course it wasn't atheists either. :shock:
There was once a dyslexic insomniac who was an agnostic. He stayed up all night wondering if there was a dog.
Got that as my sig. line on 2 other discussion boards Oy. Would put it here but it's too long for what webbie allows. Craig
Oy...I've attended many church services where the minister said that the only way to heaven was through Jesus Christ. That sorta sounds like condemning someone for not believing in Jesus.
