Cop acted 'stupidly'??....and the 'fearless leader' did not?!?

The "nutcase" or "radical bigot" aspects would not be relevant as that cannot cause any action the police would not already undertake. Unless are saying they expected they would get away with the actions if he had not been a known figure.

 

No, just trying to understand your position. I do not believe either side manipulated the other at this point, but both let the situation control them as opposed to the other way around.

 

Sounds more like fear of the law from that description.

 

VolleyGirl, don't ever give up the fight for whats right. They will lose in the end. Good will always win over evil.

Have a new game. It's called name a lib on 4042 Discussion Group. I get to start. Wayne Stollings, Hught, turtletits, nevilock, mnredsky, Loki, Hatteras6, Obama,

Get ready for some fun. They don't like being called out.

 

Actually, i kinda dig it.


HEY, DID YOU HEAR?! NEVILOCK HAS LIBERAL SOCIAL IDEALS!



Also, is Barack Obama on 4042? Thats interesting. I was unaware.

 

Does that mean RealityCheck is also a lib given the posts in this thread?

 

Raleigh Police Profiling?

I went to the Charlie Daniels concert in Moore Square last night. There was a very strong police presence in the area. You would have thought that a terrorist act had just happened. They were patrolling with bikes, cars and on foot. Well on my way home I drove by the new convention center. I noticed a few hundred African-Americans standing outside (dressed in white) and going in and out of the center. What was different about the two places was there was no cops anywhere to be found at the conventin center. I even drove around the block once looking for them. There were groups of people standing around drinking and doing whatever they pleased with no harrasment for having open containers. Now why would the Raleigh Police be so worried about the Charlie Daniels crowd and not what was going on at the convention center?

I'm sure by making this observation I'll be labeled a racist AGAIN by the 4042 ACLU crowd on here. I'm sure a non-racist would have never noticed what was going on between the two places, right libs?

 

The lady doth protest too much, methinks

 

I won't give up. I'm not into naming libs though because those that are here have made it pretty clear and need no introduction. I also wouldn't want to involve the innocent (TP and Red) in things that I know no matter what their political leanings would rather stay out of. But no, I'm not going anywhere.

 

That's fine. I just feel like Gates was waiting to have a run in with the law so that he could start screaming racial profiling. He saw his opportunity and made sure to take full advantage of it.

 

I imagine he could have expected a run in given the reports of bias regarding both the Cambridge and campus police departments. I can also imagine he was not in the best of moods after travelling home and finding the door was jammed at the end of the trip and then having the police come by for a visit. I suppose you "master-plan" outlook is a bit harder to enact unless there is something to those complaints, but you wish to ignore that implication at all costs.

 

I was just wondering. How long do you think he was waiting for that confrontation before it happened? Hours? Days? Weeks? Months? Years? When was the last time you had the potential for a police confrontation other than from your personal relationship with a police officer? It makes you wonder how he could know it was ever going to come doesn't it? Well, not you per se, but most average people.

 

Yes I am a lib......a libertarian who believes in the right of the property owner over those of a police state. I did also work for the Department of Correction in custody and as an instructor during a 30 year career that also included teaching in the University system and heaven forbid.....teaching BLET...Basic Law Enforcement Training at the Community College. Not trying to call anyone out....think he's always been open about it...but Shadow Rider retired as a Prison Superintendent and was a certified self-defense and cultural diversity instructor with the DOC......so some of us have been there...and have been trained how to interact with people without causing a community incident. I was in a class one time taught by SR in which he told the funniest story about putting your ego in check and ignoring insults in a professional manner....maybe he could be coaxed out of retirement and teach again....some evidently need it.

 

My question is "was the law broken"? If yes, because a black person was involved should the police look the other way and do nothing???? I don't think so. Once the man was asked to identify himself everything started to go downhill. You're responsible for your own actions and as such you should be prepared to pay the price. Now because the police showed up in the interest of trying to protect this homeowner from a break in all heck has broken loose. It appears to me that the little old man is the racist. What did the officer involved do to earn this tag? His job!!!! What a crock.:nopity:

 

Judging by the reports of both accounts, I'd say the police officer was following policy. It seemed Gates took a belligerent tone with the officer. If you read both accounts, you'll see that Gates initially either refused to come outside or went inside to retrieve ID. To me, I would think that a LEO is bound to stay with a suspect until positive ID is obtained. If the officer merely stepped inside the residence and did not attempt to subdue him in the home, it sounds as if the officer was doing what most police officers would do. The image of Gates on his front porch shows an individual who is obviously agitated and the law officers rather cool and collective. It also appears they are leading him out of his house and Crowley has stepped aside and is allowing another officer to take Gates out. Looks like protocol to me.

Now the arrest probably could have been avoided, but its like this. This wasn't about race, but about egos. Gates obviously has an ego and LEOs must have a high degree of self-confidence as well. Gates pushed the Cambridge officers there to the brink of having appeared above the law if his statement of <paraphrasing here> 'you don't know who you're messing with' is an accurate statement. That sounds threatening to me.

Here's the proof in the pudding for me. I'm white and I'm confident that if I had been in a similar situation with such an attitude, I would have likely been arrested. However, lacking the political clout that Dr. Gates had, I'm convinced that mostly anyone (white, black, hispanic, asian, etc.) would have likely faced charges and had to go through the court system. Gates got off light because he's an affluent individual; not because he's black or the police officers were in the wrong.

 

Bingo.

 

Please feel free to post where I have called the cop a racist or even said this was about race. I agree wholeheartedly with Jester in that it was about egos. The big question to me however is: What was the danger in not making an arrest? Police are held to a higher standard because they are agents of the government and should know how to de-esculate a situation. Getting back in the car and leaving was not going to endanger anyone. The arrest came after ID was shown, so that is why to me it become a civil libertarian matter. If you can arrest someone on the porch they own for talking smack to a policeman when no violence is being promoted, then it would be fine to arrest someone sitting on their porch talking smack about President Obama as a presidential motorcade came riding by.

And yes I was a supervisor for many years in the Dept of Correction and no inmate could have been convicted on a communicating a threat charge just for saying, "You don't know who you're messing with". Probably why the charges against Gates got dropped because everyone who didn't have their ego on their shoulders saw the charges would never stick in criminal court.

Would be interesting to see how many people in that town have been convicted of Disorderly conduct for being loud on their own porch while never promoting violence or threatening anyone.

 

You're talking about the All White Attire Fundraiser for HIV/AIDS awareness. I can definitely see how the couple hundred people in attendance there would necessitate a visible police presence in comparison with a parallel free concert sponsored by an alcohol company which was expected to bring in 8,000 - 9,000 people. I'm sure this will scare you EVEN MORE though, back in April (april 29th & 30th) 730+ Game industry professionals, gamers, and recruiters attended the convention center/Marriot for the inaugural Triangle Games Conference with almost NO police presence... not even for traffic!!! Where were the police for this one?! =O

 

And every choice you or your colleagues made could never have been second guessed by anyone else? Everyone is going to find themselves in the same kind of position where they look back and I'm sure this officer feels that way - would have done something different even if he was not in the wrong with what he did in the first place.

 

Voices of reason are always nice. Thank you. Another thing is this - how many officers ended up at the scene? I know of at least one other and then in the photo there might have been more. I'm sure he mentioned to the other officers that he was going to make the arrest and if it was truly not the right thing to do at the time they would have told him as much. Whether they did and he chose to do something different I don't know, but it sounds like the other officer that came forward also thought he was in the right.